Old judgement/old state

[jezter6]

I was sued by discover back in 2003/2004 timeframe (don't remember excatly). Stupidly, I didn't show up and they got their default judgement for almost $3500. This was in PA

Today I get a letter from an attorney saying:

We obtained judgement against you which created a lein against your property. We attempted to contact you to pay this debt (*cough*BULL****-first I've heard of you*cough*)

This is the last contact or we may file a writ of execution and instruct the sheriff to levy your personal property. You owe Discover $4500. You have 20 days to address the situation or we will advise our client of it's ability to proceed (*cough*wow, you can advise them that they can do something that they could have already done - top notch lawyering you guys are doing for your "client"*cough*)

This communication is from a debt collector"

So, good news - this company has volunteered themselves to be debt collectors and now liable for FDCPA violations. Hell of a start.

Now, how do I find out if these people really are the lawyers that filed suit against me in a county 3.5 hours and another state from me?

Can they even threaten to do this if they haven't moved the judgement to my new state??

They give me 20 days to respond or they will proceed with the above legal action -- is that kind of time frame threat legal?

Should I start with a DV since they're a debt collector by their own admission and see what they do?

Really, I'd like to see how many violations I can get on these creeps and use them to pay off this bill.

[ualbany18]

Now, how do I find out if these people really are the lawyers that filed suit against me in a county 3.5 hours and another state from me?



Does not matter, there is a judgment entered, any attorney can enforce it.



Can they even threaten to do this if they haven't moved the judgement to my new state??



In order for them to do enforcement proceedings against you, the judgment has to be domesticated. In some states that is as simple as filing it with the Supreme/Superior court of the county you live in, other states require you to be sued again.


They give me 20 days to respond or they will proceed with the above legal action -- is that kind of time frame threat legal?


That is just them being nice to try and help you settle the debt without any involuntary enforcement, they can proceed with legal action in 20 minutes if they wanted to because a judgment has been entered.



Should I start with a DV since they're a debt collector by their own admission and see what they do?


Your time to DV has loooonngggg passed my friend. If you do DV them they will most likely just send you a copy of the judgment that was duly entered against you.



Really, I'd like to see how many violations I can get on these creeps and use them to pay off this bill.



Probably not as many as you'd think, there are still laws to protect the consumer after judgment but it is no where as strict as the fair debt act.

[ditaloca]

Anyone reading ualb's posts should read his other masterpieces on the forum, this way you can see what its worth and what to do with it.

I guess the economy has affectEd every field it would appear the ceo of mcm has found the forum.

[ualbany18]

Yep, it's just unfortunate that I am 100% right here.

[newryman]

Yep, it's just unfortunate that I am 100% right here.

Grading your own papers is not credible to most people. ;)

[ditaloca]

That's the problem with the delusional, they 100% believe that they are not delusional.

How do you reason with someone who thinks 2+2 = 5 ?


Maybe delusional is too nice, ualb is more ignorant than delusional.

Its never been done before but maybe this forum will be able to teach a donkey (jacka$$) how to be a stallion as they say.


I love the holier than thou attitude he takes, its super cute. " I have 5 to 7 months savings" I would never be in your situation because I plan ahead.... awh the best laid plans of mice and men.

[jezter6]

Does not matter, there is a judgment entered, any attorney can enforce it.

I guess I should re-word my question on this...

How do I know this "collection attorney" is actually assigned this debt and can do this, and isn't just some random people trying to collect money and not send it to the OC?



In order for them to do enforcement proceedings against you, the judgment has to be domesticated. In some states that is as simple as filing it with the Supreme/Superior court of the county you live in, other states require you to be sued again.

Got that. As far as I know, it hasn't. Reading my local laws, it says that when it's domesticated the court has to send the debtor notification and it's possible to get the judgment vacated on procedural grounds (improper service). Now, I don't expect to do that in this instance, but I haven't been notified that this is possible, and I doubt the time it takes to go through this process is less than 20 days.



That is just them being nice to try and help you settle the debt without any involuntary enforcement, they can proceed with legal action in 20 minutes if they wanted to because a judgment has been entered.

Speaking of "settle" -- any chance these guys will settle now? I have a few bucks to make a settlement offer if it will just end this. But I'm also needing new tired on my truck and am moving in the next few months, so I don't have all that money.



Your time to DV has loooonngggg passed my friend. If you do DV them they will most likely just send you a copy of the judgment that was duly entered against you.

Well, my thought was - they are a debt collector and this is my first contact - at least it would buy me a few days/weeks while they mail the paperwork out.




Probably not as many as you'd think, there are still laws to protect the consumer after judgment but it is no where as strict as the fair debt act.

Judgement or not - they admit to being a collector, thus subject to the FDCPA, even if the judgement is entered.


Yes, I get this guy's pro-collector stance. However, in certain instances I've seen that his responses have been helpful.

I have no intention of trying to get out of the debt, I just don't have the means to pay this and if I get garnished for a decent amount - I'm going to have trouble paying rent and my car - which I need to get to work...

[unusualsuspect]

Judgments can be settled for far less... but you're not quite there yet.

He's already opened himself to FDCPA, so why not use it?

Go through the process... ask for validation and see what happens. If the judgment is in a different state, and the lawyers actually have to do work to get sister state recognition, there's a good chance that they'll go away.

[ualbany18]

How do I know this "collection attorney" is actually assigned this debt and can do this, and isn't just some random people trying to collect money and not send it to the OC?


This is a good question, in my experiences OC's hire us to represent them. If we find out a debtor lives in a different state before or after judgment, our firm hires an attorney in the state that the defedant lives in to collect for us. The good thing about debt collection, it's very easy to obtain records and keep records.


Got that. As far as I know, it hasn't. Reading my local laws, it says that when it's domesticated the court has to send the debtor notification and it's possible to get the judgment vacated on procedural grounds (improper service). Now, I don't expect to do that in this instance, but I haven't been notified that this is possible, and I doubt the time it takes to go through this process is less than 20 days.


Yes, but you would have to get the judgment vacated in the court of original jurisdiction. For instance in New Jersey, the Superior Court will send a copy of the judgment to the defendant giving them 14 days to object. If they object to the judgment they have to prove to the NJ court that they are ongoing proceedings in the court of original jurisdiction to have the judgment vacated. The court in the state you live in now does not have jurisdiction to overturn your judgment.



Speaking of "settle" -- any chance these guys will settle now? I have a few bucks to make a settlement offer if it will just end this. But I'm also needing new tired on my truck and am moving in the next few months, so I don't have all that money.


I would say yes. You should be able to get a reasonable settlement at this point.


Well, my thought was - they are a debt collector and this is my first contact -at least it would buy me a few days/weeks while they mail the paperwork out.


Right, if you send them a DV letter - all they would have to send you is a copy of the judgment. (Which they are going to have to do if they domesticate it anyway). But it will probably buy you 7 days or so.


Judgement or not - they admit to being a collector, thus subject to the FDCPA, even if the judgement is entered.


Yup, but it is nowhere near the same rules and regulations as an account that is prior to suit. Like for instance, they still cannot call you before 8am or after 9pm. However debt validation is much different. There is a court ordered judgment so you can't dispute the amount, the interest, the fees or the penalties because that is set by statute.


Yes, I get this guy's pro-collector stance. However, in certain instances I've seen that his responses have been helpful.


Post Judgment enforcement is what I have been doing for the past 3 1/2 years. When it comes to this stuff, I'm right on the money.

[jezter6]

Thanks ualbany. I take your replies with a grain of salt, but I think you've turned around on some of your previous attitudes and I thank you for your replies.

If they need someone to collect on the judgement in my state, should I hold out and see what they intend to do after 20 days? I mean - I know they didn't domesticate and at least I will know if/when they do try and do it (yes, I know I don't have anything to really fight it - but at least it's a "sign" that they're getting super serious).

As to settlement - do you think 50% is possible at this point? I was going to write them and offer something somewhat low and see what they come back with (I was going to go about 20%).

Also, regarding this "writ of execution" and levy my assets...

I don't have much of anything. I have my truck (2002 Jeep that I still owe $10k on - so I'm way underwater on that one), a 4 year old computer, clothes, and a bed. My bank account has a little money in it, but I'm getting ready to move and that's planned for security deposit stuff and new tires for the truck. That money will be gone in the next 30 days or so based on what I need to get done outside of this suit.

Would they take my truck, even though I'm way underwater on it?

My theory is, if they start to act, I'll file BK and just be done with it (I do have some other judgements that are hanging out since 2003 from my divorce). I don't love my truck, so I'm not scared of losing it - I'm scared of not having any transportation to work and no backup money in savings to go buy a beater. And I don't want to spend $800 on tires if they're going to take my truck anyway.

[ualbany18]

As to settlement - do you think 50% is possible at this point? I was going to write them and offer something somewhat low and see what they come back with (I was going to go about 20%)


Being in a different state, which means there is additional costs and fees to domesticate the judgment I would say 50% is very reasonable offer to make.


Would they take my truck, even though I'm way underwater on it?


Technically yes they can, but since your vehicle has has a lien on it (and it's over 10k) your truck is not a very appealing piece of real property.

[newryman]

Is there some pressing reason why you feel the need to settle this? You may wish to explore other options first.

[jezter6]

The only reason I'd like to settle is to prevent wage garnishment for the full amount. I live paycheck to paycheck as it is, and barely managed to save up enough funds to move. I'm having difficulty finding a new place to live as is - and I don't want them to take what money I do have saved up and/or start taking money out of my already depleted paycheck.

[newryman]

UNITED STATES CODE: TITLE 15, CHAPTER 41, SUBCHAPTER II


§ 1673. Restriction on garnishment


(a) Maximum allowable garnishment


Except as provided in subsection (b) of this section and in section 1675 of this title, the maximum part of the aggregate disposable earnings of an individual for any workweek which is subjected to garnishment may not exceed


(1) 25 per centum of his disposable earnings for that week, or
(2) the amount by which his disposable earnings for that week exceed thirty times the Federal minimum hourly wage prescribed by section 206 (a)(1) of title 29 in effect at the time the earnings are payable,
whichever is less. In the case of earnings for any pay period other than a week, the Secretary of Labor shall by regulation prescribe a multiple of the Federal minimum hourly wage equivalent in effect to that set forth in paragraph


(b) Exceptions


(1) The restrictions of subsection (a) of this section do not apply in the case of
(A) any order for the support of any person issued by a court of competent jurisdiction or in accordance with an administrative procedure, which is established by State law, which affords substantial due process, and which is subject to judicial review.
(B) any order of any court of the United States having jurisdiction over cases under chapter 13 of title 11.
(C) any debt due for any State or Federal tax.
(2) The maximum part of the aggregate disposable earnings of an individual for any workweek which is subject to garnishment to enforce any order for the support of any person shall not exceed
(A) where such individual is supporting his spouse or dependent child (other than a spouse or child with respect to whose support such order is used), 50 per centum of such individual's disposable earnings for that week; and
(B) where such individual is not supporting such a spouse or dependent child described in clause (A), 60 per centum of such individual's disposable earnings for that week;
except that, with respect to the disposable earnings of any individual for any workweek, the 50 per centum specified in clause (A) shall be deemed to be 55 per centum and the 60 per centum specified in clause (B) shall be deemed to be 65 per centum, if and to the extent that such earnings are subject to garnishment to enforce a support order with respect to a period which is prior to the twelve-week period which ends with the beginning of such workweek.


(c) Execution or enforcement of garnishment order or process prohibited


No court of the United States or any State, and no State (or officer or agency thereof), may make, execute, or enforce any order or process in violation of this section.

[jezter6]

God, I hate lawyerese...

What's 25% of disposable income?? :)

[unusualsuspect]

It's the income you have left after rent, utilities, food, transportation...

[jezter6]

Oh, well 25% of $4 is gonna be about a buck a week.

That's never gonna get paid off at that rate...

[newryman]

Oh, well 25% of $4 is gonna be about a buck a week.

That's never gonna get paid off at that rate...

Hence my question about is there a particular need for you to settle it at this stage? The older it gets the less valuable it becomes. You are essentially judgement proof in the real world if, they want to pay the admin costs to collect $1 a week more fools them.

Some collectors will foolishly claim that judgements are like annuities. i can only assume they were employed by Lehman brothers previously. A non performing judgement of $10,000 that you cant realistically collect on is not a great investment just because interest that you can not collect either gets added. :roll:

Just like debt there is a secondary market in judgements. It may get sold on in an attempt for them to recover something. No one can say for sure. Make sure your bank account remains close to empty.

[jezter6]

Well, obviously I was exaggerating a little on the whole $4 thing, but it's not much when you consider my child support being taken out.

I will work on the bank account thing this week, just in case.